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“c.860 Kenstec, bishop-elect to the nation of Cornwall, in the monastery which in the British language
is called Dinurrin.
Part of Bishop Kenstec’s submission to the See of Canterbury”
Posted: February 09, 2013
Start the discussion
This comes from the book of a person who is a member of the 'Celtic league'; there is no clear definition of who the Celts were and there was never a race who called themselves Celts. The terms 'Celt, Celts, Celtic' were used to describe a wide range of peoples, not just one race.
So, you rely on the writings of a person who has a clear and biased agenda; nice one.
Nobody I have ever met has had a particular problem with the word and meaning of 'Celtic', so perhaps YOU have an unclear biased agenda CallingtonFox.
Cornwall and the Cornish have a Brythonic Celtic heritage and language in keeping with Wales and Brittany.
The origins of Brythonic Celts are pinpointed more accurately and updated as more evidence is discovered. Currently, i believe, they are thought to have migrated to Britain from Iberia to the Western regions of Britain after the last Ice Age. The latest genetic work confirms a lot of this and shows distinct differences to, for example, Anglo-Saxon and Norse provenances for other constituents of Britain.
The only problem I have ever found with the word Celtic is whether pronounced with a hard or soft 'c'.
Carvath, the term Celtic does not refer to one race or nation of people; it was a blanket name used to describe many.
There was never a race who described themselves as 'Celts or Celtic'. So yes, I do have a problem with the term being used to claim 'nationhood'.
Kenstec was a medieval Bishop of Cornwall.
He was consecrated between 833 and 870. His death date is unknown.
His seat lay in "the monastery of Dinuurrin"' which may be Bodmin. He professed obedience to the Archbishop of Canterbury, marking a stage in the incorporation of Cornwall into the English church. It is not clear whether there was only one bishop in Cornwall at this time, as there may have been another at St Germans, and it is also not clear whether Cornish bishoprics continued into the later ninth century.
CallingtonFox, the term Celt, or Celts, or Celtic, is a term that is used to describe a culture. It is not a racial name. The people from the "Celtic fringe", Scotland Wales, Cornwall, are referred to as Celts, Celtic, because they descend from peoples of a Celtic culture.
It is quite clear, there is no confusion. The term was coined, as I understand it, following the "Act Of Union", prior to that the people of the Celtic Fringe were collectively known as Britons, a term that came to be used to describe all the peoples of this Island following that act, and it was early antiquarians that decided to "name" those from the fringe as Celt.
Paddy, I have seen it used with all kinds of meanings attached to it; even to attach a culture to those names lacks foundation; unless of course you accept those peoples, named by others and not themselves, as Celts are made up of many groups who came here from Europe.
Also, to claim Cornwall as Celtic means accepting the fact that vast swathes of Britain were settled by these arbitrarily labelled tribes; your ancestors and mine.
Anyway, the issue for me, is not the label, it is the meanings certain people read into it and then use that to make certain claims regarding territory and national foundations.
There is a great deal of diversity across the country but we are all far more linked historically and culturally than otherwise
I found this the other day which I hope you will all find interesting http://tinyurl.com/qvs4dq
The above link takes you to work written by a Simon James, archaeologist, university teacher and writer; the quote below is taken from one of his sites:
"In recent works I investigated the reasons for the establishment of the notion of the 'Celticness' of the European Iron Age, and explored the ramifications of its general rejection as a useful interpretative framework by British (and, increasingly, Irish) prehistorians. This is a matter of importance, given the continued use of the Celtic paradigm elsewhere in the historical sciences (e.g. in continental Iron Age archaeology, and in early medieval studies), in other academic disciplines (from philology to population genetics), and not least in popular cultural, historical and political discourses. I have published a number of books and articles on these subjects (SJ 1993a, 1998a, 1999a; SJ & Rigby 1998), and maintain a personal webpage aimed at the general public, which generates much interesting dialogue."
More utter rubbish from Callington Fox who is an English Nationalist.
The above quote is historically recorded and is one of many contained in a paper submitted to the Westminster Government by Cornwall Council and signed by the leaders of EVERY political bloc in the Council as well as a representative of the Independents.
Cornwall, a Celtic Nation next to Anglo Saxon England, a bit like Celtic Wales. Cornish not English by provision of International Law. Cornwall, a region of Europe as recognised by the European Commission.
Yes, Angof2012, of course; nice of you to pop-in by the way.
CallingtonFox, you seem obsessed with definitions and appear unable to move beyond such things, whether it be 'nation' or 'Celtic', for example. To me it signifies a fear of approach or lack of breadth of knowledge about a subject and non-confidence. It reminds me of scientists of many different disciplines unable to agree on a definition of the Second Law of Thermodynamics where in fact there can be several "definitions", all in the end meaning the same thing about a universal law. It detracts from the main purpose of the law which is making possible important predictions and calculations in the many facets of science it applies to. The same applies here IMO.
What is the difference between law and theory?
A "law" is a readily observable fact about something. It is something that is obvious and undeniable. Allow me to clear up a common misconception right now, laws are not a "higher" stage than theory, and no theory ever becomes a law. Laws are simple and obvious statements about a phenomenon that never require a second guess, or an experiment, to verify them (for example, there is a law that states that there exists an apparent attraction between all objects having positive mass...it's called the law of Gravity, and it's not just undeniable, but it's readily observable and demonstrable (by virtue of the simple fact that you are not floating about, but are anchored to the Earth)).
Care to explain why you think "Celtic" is anything more than a definition?
I think that's what my whole post was about.
Slimslad, gravity's a myth, the Earth sucks.
"..the Earth sucks."
Most mirth worthy :)
So "Celtic" is a Law?
My, your feet are certainly on the ground. LOL
If history doesn't agree with you?
Make up your own.
While there is no historical list of Cornish Bishops, Dr Stubbs says legend has preserved the names of some; and there is at Canterbury a letter written by Kenstec or Kenstet, Bishop-elect of the Cornish people, in which he declares his faith to Ceolnoth, Archbishop of Canterbury, 833-70. Conan, the native Cornish Bishop, was a member of Athelstan's Witenagemot from 931, and Cornwall was from that time an English diocese.
By golly Big-Ger youm pretty given that there Wikipaedia a thrashin lately Boy careful you dunt go und boil youm water.
The quote in my last message is not from wikipedia, but never mind, you carry on embarrassing yourself.
Something about your area!
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