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“Scottish independence within SNP’s grasp - poll

http://tinyurl.com/nrb7ver


This will start the ball rolling in the British Isles and right across Europe.”

By AnBalores Posted: January 26, 2014

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  • Slimslad  |  January 26 2014, 4:51PM

    "Scottish independence within SNP's grasp - poll (Article). This will start the ball rolling in the British Isles and right across Europe."(Personal opinion).

  • rickoon  |  January 26 2014, 6:08PM

    Only applicable for Cornwall if someone comes and take them by the hand and show the way.

  • Big_Ger  |  January 26 2014, 11:31PM

    Meet the footsoldiers of pro-Scottish independence 'army' whose online poison shames the Nationalists http://tinyurl.com/nv4yx2f

  • PaddyTrembath  |  January 27 2014, 11:07AM

    Quote Mailonline :- "Some Nationalists have rightly pointed out that there are offensive tweeters, or online activists, on both sides; and there will always be those who pour out abuse unthinkingly, solely to cause offence." e.g.:- "Only applicable for Cornwall if someone comes and take them by the hand and show the way."

  • rickoon  |  January 27 2014, 12:38PM

    Prove me wrong Paddy boy…if you can. Not forgetting to provide the evidence lol.

  • PaddyTrembath  |  January 27 2014, 1:33PM

    Quote Mailonline :- "Some Nationalists have rightly pointed out that there are offensive tweeters, or online activists, on both sides; and there will always be those who pour out abuse unthinkingly, solely to cause offence." e.g.:- "Only applicable for Cornwall if someone comes and take them by the hand and show the way." And :- "Prove me wrong Paddy boy…if you can. Not forgetting to provide the evidence lol."

  • rickoon  |  January 27 2014, 4:52PM

    No offence from me Paddy, I am more Cornish than theet art lol.

  • kclarkDD  |  January 27 2014, 10:31PM

    @Big_Ger. I would advise you to visit the Wings Over Scotland website and check out "Edited Highlights" and "The Bully Pulpit" for a less hysterical slant on this so-called story. There is no such thing as a cybernat army being controlled by Salmond. It is purely a construct of the British state. They are trying to shut down the part of the debate they can't control. Unlike the BBC, which a study has shown is skewing the referendum debate in favour of the NO camp.

  • kclarkDD  |  January 29 2014, 1:04PM

    As an addendum to my last post concerning Big_Gers' accusation of cybernat poison, based on Daily Mail articles, you can add the Wings Over Scotland's articles, "My Cybernat Shame" and "Daily Mail Fact Watch". I have in the past warned participants on this site to be wary of anything the traditional British news outlets offer you regarding Scotland's referendum and to double check everything. In case some of you feel this is just paranoid Scottish nationalist rubbish, the study I mention above was conducted by a team at the University of the West of Scotland, led by a Dr John Robertson. Entitled, "Fairness In The First Year?" it found both BBC and STV were leaning heavily towards favouring the NO camp. The report can be read on newsnetscotland under "An Academic Study Into TV News Reporting Of The Scottish Independence Referendum". The report was sent to the Herald which chose not to publish and hasn't featured on any of the BBC TV news programmes. This highlights the importance of sites such as NNS and WOS. They may be a thorn in the flesh of Whitehall, but are sadly needed in this skewed debate. The BBC incidentally, while refusing to acknowledge the study, saw fit to email Dr Robertson in an attempt to intimidate him. Unsuccessfully I am glad to say. Presenting the YES camp exclusively as Alex Salmond and the SNP, while referring to the NO side as a disparate group is just one of the deceits the report highlighted. The YES camp have support across Scottish society, not just the SNP, and this crude attempt to personalise the issue is a disgrace. Even a piece of time filling fluff such as "The One Show" was guilty of this last night. The claim that Salmond is the head of the YES campaign is dishonest and reveals either shabby reporting or an effort to perpetuate the myth that Scottish independence is a "Salmond vanity project", as it's been described more than once. Blair Jenkins and Dennis Canavan lead the YES campaign. The researchers at the "One Show" must know this. Couple this with unionist politicians and newspapers attempting to stifle the on-line debate, by demonising YES supporters and portraying them as a threat to British democracy, is a ludicrous and panicky reaction to a forum they can't control. I will leave you to decide which is the greater threat to our democracy. Individuals who campaign for a better Scotland or a British state willing to compromise whatever principles it has left by, and lets not mince our words here, lying not only to Scots but to people such as yourselves. They got away with it in 1979, but it's not so easy a trick to pull off in our 21st century, multi-media society.

  • rickoon  |  January 29 2014, 2:07PM

    "it found both BBC and STV were leaning heavily towards favouring the NO camp." Regarding Scotland, the media will play a very big part determining how people will vote, their influencing power will pick off those who are not really sold for Scotland not even Scottish but entitled to vote. If this were to happen regarding Cornwall things wouldn't be so complicated with us all being one people.

  • kclarkDD  |  January 29 2014, 3:45PM

    The United Kingdom is in no way "united". The current drive for Scottish independence is just one sign of the dissatisfaction at the heart of Britain today. The problem is neatly summed up by broadcaster Derek Bateman in his most recent blog, "Knees up, knees up..." where he highlights London's pernicious influence on us all. Derek used to work for the BBC, but decided to leave because of that corporation's attitude towards the debate. Scottish self determination has a long and proud history and a NO vote garnered on the back of a dishonest media campaign will not stop it happening at some point. Hopefully however, Scotland will vote YES and be a catalyst for much needed change in these dis_United Kingdoms.

  • Slimslad  |  January 30 2014, 9:43AM

    "skewing the referendum debate"? 16 and 17-year olds to vote. Who is paying for the voter registration for these children? Step forward the SNP.

  • kclarkDD  |  January 30 2014, 12:11PM

    @Slimslad "16 and 17 year olds to vote" They are old enough to pay taxes so have every right to vote in the referendum. Even the SNP's opponents now agree. Generation after generation reaches the age of voter registration. Who pays for that? To complain about the cost of including the next generation in an event as historically important as this seems rather churlish don't you think? The SNP's manifesto at the last Holyrood election included the referendum as a major component. They gained a majority in a PR parliament and have a mandate from their electorate Cameron, Clegg and Milliband can only dream of. The SNP may be the British state's public enemy number one, but their legitimacy can't be questioned, no matter how much it irks Whitehall.

  • IainS  |  January 30 2014, 1:29PM

    Very well put kclarkDD. The English band of brothers here, some of whom aren't even in Cornwall, would never understand that Scotland has its own legal system and so if 16/17 year olds are allowed to vote then so be it. As it stands, they and many others aren't bothered with the Westminster parliament which stands for corruption and to protect the interests of a wealthy minority. I so hope the people of Scotland vote YES. They will then be free of the truly dreadful English system which has done none of us much good. And yes, the opinion polls are looking good for a brighter future for Scotland. Other votes to follow in Britain and Europe? For sure. Catalonia next.

  • rickoon  |  January 30 2014, 1:36PM

    It would benefit some in Cornwall if there were going to be an election of this kind for Cornwall, the lower the age to vote the better, this would be the only way they could even think of swaying any kind of vote, by getting voters young and innocent straight from kindergarten.

  • IainS  |  January 30 2014, 5:54PM

    Ah, the voice from afar, near Birmingham somewhere I have been informed? "by getting voters young and innocent straight from kindergarten" yes indeed, from the kindergarten but old enough to work full time, to procreate legally, to join military forces and so on. Perhaps the 16 and 17 year olds aren't as aware up your way Young Cornwall?

  • rickoon  |  January 30 2014, 6:38PM

    "yes indeed, from the kindergarten but old enough to work full time" Yes I can go with that, there will soon be a calling for interpreters and translators in the Cornish language.

  • lovelycornwal  |  January 31 2014, 9:46AM

    You can't help but feel sorry for the Scottish people when it comes to independants as the polls show it's split, not everyone is looking at the SNP and going yes, so will there be issues locally and nationally for the people of Scotland after they'd had their vote? And Salmond is the same as most politicians out for himself and his ideas not the hero painted by many IMO. What the future will hold who really knows? Only hope the good times are better than the bad ones.

  • kclarkDD  |  January 31 2014, 12:05PM

    @lovelycornwal Where do you get your opinion of Salmond from if you don't mind me asking? Salmond has campaigned all his life for Scottish independence. He runs a popular government, even though not one media outlet supports them, whose goal it is to improve the lives of everyone under their influence. I can understand your poor opinion of politicians in general, but to say Salmond is out for himself needs a bit more substance than just a statement saying it is so. I know the British press portray him as a vainglorious individual, so I can understand where such views originate from. However, I would refer you to my previous posts on this thread and caution you on taking everything at face value. The British establishment in all it's forms has a long history of vilifying anyone it deems to be a threat to it's own position. You also fall into the trap of equating Scottish independence with Salmond. Please believe me, support for it spreads far wider than the orbit of the SNP. Come independence the SNP will go into a Scottish General Election with a manifesto, along with all the other parties who wish to govern Scotland. All the issues, locally and nationally, will be dealt with then. We will not be living in a dictatorship, but a fully functioning democracy with a government which represents Scotland's interests, not the Home Counties.

  • AnBalores  |  January 31 2014, 1:23PM

    I would point out that our colleagues in the Scottish Green Party are part of the YES Campaign and fully support Scottish independence. We have elected members in the Scottish Parliament and as councillors. Indeed, we have an MP in the Westminster Parliament. We also support the fullest possibly devolution of powers to a Cornish Assembly. The London and mainly Westminster controlled and orientated media machine is to be viewed with extreme caution as is the Westminster Government. After all, lives were needlessly lost in Iraq over fabricated weapons of mass destruction, a dubious campaign in Libya has ended up with continuing bloodshed in that country and the Afghan operation will prove to be utterly futile.

  • lovelycornwal  |  January 31 2014, 2:47PM

    @KclarkDD, "Salmond has campaigned all his life for Scottish independence." No he hasn't, he started I believe in 1973 :) "He runs a popular government," Check the numbers who didn't vote for the SNP in 2011 :) "I can understand your poor opinion of politicians in general, but to say Salmond is out for himself needs a bit more substance than just a statement saying it is so" So many points I could make here, but I'll give one, take his childcare proposals, could be introduced now but he choose to implement them only after a yes vote, hang on is he interested in the best for children or? "I know the British press portray him as a vainglorious individual, so I can understand where such views originate from." You fall into the trap of thinking the press always form the opinion that matters to people and anyone posting is either on one side or the other and it is all about independents, have you see the polls that show how many are not at all bothered about the idea one way or another? I know you like to have all the good points laid out here, but come on you're not so convincing on a forum when you show one side only!

  • AnBalores  |  January 31 2014, 6:37PM

    I received this today on my twitter account ICM poll for "Scotland on Sunday" (26/1/14). The poll of a 1000 over 16's was conducted by ICM between Tuesday and Friday last week. It shows that support for Independence has grown from 32% to 37% since September. Support for the UK status quo has fallen from 49% to 44%. Furthermore, when pressed many of the "don't knows" indicated that they were more inclined -if they did vote- to vote "Yes." The Chief Executive of the "Yes" Campaign Blair Jenkins has said it is an "excellent place to be at this stage in the campaign." A further 3% swing will see the "Yes" Campaign take the lead.

  • kclarkDD  |  February 01 2014, 12:31AM

    @lovelycornwal. I could have said all his political life, but I assumed you would understand that. ;) Check the numbers who are intending to vote for the unionist parties in the forthcoming European elections in Scotland and compare and contrast with the SNP's approval ratings. The childcare proposals hinge on the revenues accrued by the implementation remaining in Scotland to help pay for it. Not disappearing into London's black hole as does so much of Scottish revenue. Child care has improved in Scotland since the SNP took charge as have other aspects of Scottish life. This, during a recession. You say you have "many points" regarding Salmond. I would like to hear them please. Labour's George Foulkes had the temerity to complain that the SNP were deliberately making life better for Scots. I realise, as a Westminster politician, it is an alien concept to govern for the betterment of the whole population, but Scots are embracing it and will hopefully take it to it's logical conclusion by voting for independence this September. I support independence. I commented on here in reply to big_ger's link to the nonsense published by the Mail. Anyone in the NO camp is welcome to challenge my comments, but from my perspective the NO camp's dishonesty is reaching levels which are now beyond satire. If you're interested in the other side check out the Better Together website. A more unambitious, unimaginative and uninspiring message would be harder to construct, which explains why the tide is turning against them. This also explains why many are turned off by the debate. Given the turgid contribution from the NO camp, who can blame them. Perhaps it is part of their strategy to bore people to death. :) You are, I hope being disingenuous when you state that newspapers don't influence people. The unrelentingly poor press the unionist papers give the present Scottish government has one agenda only. Like you, however, they have convinced themselves this referendum is all down to the SNP and that if they target Salmond they will win the debate. This has nothing to do with democracy, or what is best for Scotland, but is purely an effort to keep Westminster control of Scotland. A control which has never benefited us and never will.

  • lovelycornwal  |  February 01 2014, 11:39AM

    "Check the numbers who are intending to vote for the unionist parties in the forthcoming European elections in Scotland and compare and contrast with the SNP's approval ratings." Better to wait for the results than speculate! :) "The childcare proposals" According to the SNP/Salmond some 10,000 vulnerable children would be helped with these childcare 'proposals'. How long have the SNP been in power? He chooses to only look out for them after the referendum but he can/could have done this before as these proposals will be implemented anyway regardless of a yes or no vote. :) "You say you have "many points" regarding Salmond. I would like to hear them please." As a tax payer you'll know there is no 'free' lunch, someone is paying for it, politicians need to meet the approval of many and often don't so rather than list these points, I'll point out the flaws in your posts being no matter what you post it will be all about how great Salmond is and how bad the UK is and it isn't hard to see this regardless of any pros and cons, you hold a favouritism to one type of view. I therefore know it is pointless opening your eyes to the questions many have about Salmond! :) "You are, I hope being disingenuous when you state that newspapers don't influence people. The unrelentingly poor press the unionist papers give the present Scottish government has one agenda only." Really don't see the Scottish people believing all what they read. If much of the press is against the yes vote then why are so many scots thinking it is a great idea! :}

  • kclarkDD  |  February 01 2014, 2:25PM

    @lovelycornwal. Child care in Scotland has improved under the current Scottish government in a time of recession, as has many aspects of Scottish life. You may wish to ignore or deflect, or even fail to address the stark contrast of the record of the Scottish government with Westminster's, but people up here are noticing. Previous Holyrood administrations, in better times, failed on so many fronts. If you can't give credit for what the present SG are doing, or engage with the fact that the proposed child care scheme would be self funding shows an ignorance which results from the very media distortion the West of Scotland University study has flagged up. It's a simple construct which has worked in other countries. More parents in work equals more tax revenues which in turn helps pay for the cost of the scheme. Your criticism mirrors the unionists', who refuse to acknowledge that any benefits would be swallowed up by London under the present arrangement. Since you failed to answer my question as to where you get your opinions from I have to assume you have read the unionist press and have swallowed all they have fed you. This rather disproves your point of people not believing all they read. Your vague sentence about a free lunch and your inability to articulate your points regarding issues you have with Salmond isn't quite on, is it? You will criticise but not specify what these criticisms are based on. I come across this all the time. You want answers but will provide none of your own. What are the flaws in my posts for example? Your main point is that, like many Scots, I feel the SNP are governing Scotland well in difficult times and give them credit for doing so. If only the rest of the UK were able to say the same about the coalition. The polls are moving towards a YES vote. This in spite of all the negative press it receives. I ask you this. Where would we be if there had been one iota of fairness in the media's approach to this event? You are in Cornwall. You have no personal experience of being governed by the current Scottish government, yet your posts repeat one side's criticisms. Why not try newsnetscotland or Wings Over Scotland? Or do you only read articles that reinforce your own prejudices?

  • lovelycornwal  |  February 01 2014, 6:36PM

    "Your vague sentence about a free lunch and your inability to articulate your points regarding issues you have with Salmond isn't quite on, is it? You will criticise but not specify what these criticisms are based on." "Or do you only read articles that reinforce your own prejudices?" It wasn't vague it is just you benign think or difficult. You are so wrapped up in this idea you missed the point that even when your beloved polls show that people think very differently to the way the media do, you fail to see how clever the people are! As for 'childcare' it was explained why it's a waste of time raising other issues with you and as we see by your answer it is favouritism that rules you or so not really wanting to the point onboard you carried on, you haven't a clue how to deal with your own blindness on this one. You would always side with the likes of Salmond/SNP but for most of us there is a problem of apathy with government and I believe most people have an indifference towards the political division that you like to promote. Salmond to me is very much like the rest of the political world and you don't like anyone having that idea of him, but I ask how many in those polls you love have stated they couldn't careless about the whole event? Do you have any numbers for those people? I doubt it! You actually think I am unionist? lol get a grip. But I really want to see how the people of Scotland vote and that is will be interesting and you can't stop them voting yes or no. And if they vote no what for you? Will you back them or hate them?, I guessing your are going duck on that question., But you think I care about a no vote? if you do how wrong can you be but your world is one of division mine isn't. I like to see low taxes and less government it is as simple as that. And if you live in Scotland what the hell are you doing on a forum based in Cornwall? Why?

  • kclarkDD  |  February 01 2014, 8:21PM

    @ lovelycornwall. You miss the point of this debate so badly I don't know where to start. The issue of Scottish independence is so far above the petty politics of the NO camp and the likes of the Daily Mail as to be beyond their narrow vision. They poison every aspect of the process, done purely for short term political gain. You accuse me of favouritism and blindness. Do I favour good government? Yes. Am I blind to it's benefits? No. "Salmond to me is very much like the rest of the political world". You still haven't told me where you get your opinions from. You have no experience of everyday life in Scotland, so what is colouring your comments here? As AnBalores states above, the Scottish Greens are part of the YES camp, yet you insist, as does the British media, on personalising this issue with "Salmond this, Salmond that" comments. There are many other groups involved. Why don't you accept that? "Beloved polls"? The people who love the polls are the the British media and the parties they support, trumpeting favourable ones like clarion calls on a old battlefield. :) I didn't call you a unionist. I commented that you mirror their opinions, which is true. In the event of a NO vote I will dust myself down and continue to strive for a better Scotland, which is only possible without Westminster's grip on our society. A goal I have been working for all my adult life. As I gallop towards 60 I hope and pray 2014 will see that wish come to fruition. You challenge my right to be on this forum. Last year, while searching on-line for a holiday destination in Cornwall, I chanced upon a story where a local (Cornish) politician complained of Scottish subsidies. I joined the comments section, but have kept visiting this site, mostly for the debate surrounding Cornish history. The passion and pride displayed, along with the history has been fascinating. I never comment as my ignorance of the issues would be only too apparent! :) If, however, anything such as this thread appears I feel I have the right to interject. Or is this site only for local people? ;) Finally, I am not here to sell Scottish independence. I only want this hugely important decision to be decided by a fair and honest debate.

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